Arizona Congresswoman Shot and in Critical Condition

[Fluffy Cocaine]

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE7071IA20110108


I just figured this really deserved a topic. I'm really shaken up about it at the moment, actually. I understand that this is happening in Arizona and Arizona is a state of extremes, but... this is extremely disturbing.


This is what happens when fucking idiots like Sharron Angle run for public office with the message that people should "bring their guns" if they don't get what they want out of their government. Fuck the idea that that slogan just meant "bring your ammunition" in a figurative sense; she meant what she said and this is what people like her got. Exactly what they wanted.


These are truly dark days.

[Jake]

I wish I could say I'm surprised that something like this has happened but to be completely honest I've been expecting SOMEONE to be shot for the last two years.
I can't wait for more light to shed on the actual attacker.  If he's part of the tea party movement it would go a LONG way towards the deradicalization of america.

[Fluffy Cocaine]

New reports are saying that she is not dead and hospital officials are "optimistic" about her recovery. If she comes back... what a miracle.

If he's part of the tea party movement it would go a LONG way towards the deradicalization of america.

It absolutely would, which is why I'm hoping they make reports on the attacker as specific as possible.

[Rosti LFC]

The article now says she's just seriously wounded - should probably change the topic title...

If he's part of the tea party movement it would go a LONG way towards the deradicalization of america.

You really think so? You don't think there's a possibility it'll just massively escalate things and ostracise people? I can't possibly believe that all the crazy fanatics in the US lie on the Republican side.

Obligatory FFFUUUU 2nd amendment comment. That and the fact that if this starts happening on anything even approaching a regular basis then democracy in the US is lost. A public vote is meaningless if a few idiots with a gun can just start killing people if they disagree with the majority. Our politicians get abuse too, but usually people just throw eggs and stuff at them.

[Jake]

You really think so? You don't think there's a possibility it'll just massively escalate things and ostracise people? I can't possibly believe that all the crazy fanatics in the US lie on the Republican side.

Obligatory FFFUUUU 2nd amendment comment. That and the fact that if this starts happening on anything even approaching a regular basis then democracy in the US is lost. A public vote is meaningless if a few idiots with a gun can just start killing people if they disagree with the majority. Our politicians get abuse too, but usually people just throw eggs and stuff at them.

I think it'll go towards bringing the issue to the forefront.  Really the divide is something that's not been mentioned much in the news mostly because individual organizations hold their own bias.  I agree with you though rosti that this won't lessen the issue but it'll hopefully be a start to the solution.  I also agree that if this picks up in frequency then democracy has indeed been lost.  And even now (with filibusters the way they are) democracy has been changed from a majority controlled thing to either supermajority or minority controlled.  I really don't like to keep up with it anymore because the whole situation disgusts me.  That and I feel that there's no room whatsoever for moderates like myself in politics anymore.

and indeed fuuuuuuuuuuuu second amendment.  Also fuuuuuuuuuuu fifth amendment which means the assailant probably won't say jack.


   I don't know if the article mentioned this but a federal judge was indeed killed in the attack.

[Rosti LFC]

That and I feel that there's no room whatsoever for moderates like myself in politics anymore.

You should go live in Canada or Europe (though not France) where political indifference seems to be the norm

[Fluffy Cocaine]

where political indifference seems to be the norm

This comment appears to not be very serious, so I'm probably nitpicking, but I do want to point out that being a moderate and being politically indifferent are very different things.

Anyway, articles are up about the shooting suspect Jared Loughner (http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2011-01-08-jared-loughner_N.htm) and the details about him basically just point to him being a general, rank-and-file whackjob. There isn't even much necessarily pointing to the Tea Party, although the distrust in government and concern over "illiteracy" (considering people who don't speak English to be illiterate) are fairly in line with Tea Party beliefs.

As for whether this will cause an escalation or lead to the solution, I think it's both. Certainly there will be copycat attempts, although I doubt that there will be many successes, considering that security is going to be seriously strengthened as a result of this. That's the most immediate repercussion from this -- we are going to pull back from the idea of government openness and go back to members of the government having extremely heavy security and being a lot more closed-off.

The main positive I see coming out of all of this is that Republicans and Democrats alike have made strong comments against this type of behavior (even Tea Party nutjobs like Michele Bachmann and Sarah Palin are saying this is unacceptable, and McCain's statement on this was the most passionate I've seen him about anything in years). If that holds, I think we will see 2012 election campaigns back off the violence-inspiring rhetoric like "bring your guns."

[Cardinal]

yeah palin is saying it's unacceptable right after she removes the gunsight image from her website. pathetic.

anyway this shit is crazy, i've been following it and the shooter was essentially a nutjob. everything i've read doesn't put to leanings of either party, but rather towards conspiracy and shit, which i guess you could say leans towards tea party but i dunno. i'm almost hesitant to blame them just because, over something as tragic as this, the last thing we as a country need to do is be divided over what this guy's political stance was. it seems to me, at least from what i've read, that he was basically all over the place and thus can't exactly be classified.

this just scares me though, i don't want more of this to happen. american politics is shit enough as is. we're so divided, it's insane. this really needs to be a banding together moment, in all honesty. it won't be, knowing the idiocy of some of the newly elected republicans (don't get me started on them), but it would be nice to see something positive come out of this.

[Fluffy Cocaine]

Cardinal, I totally understand the idea that this is not a time for division or fighting, but I do think that this event proves that we need to have a serious nationwide discussion about the effect of the use of violence in political slogans. Whether or not this guy was Tea Party (I think he likely was not affiliated with any particular party) is irrelevant--either way, odds are, he was influenced in some way by the "get your guns" Sarah Palin/Sharron Angle campaign mentality.

I heard something about him possibly being connected to a white supremacist website. I think this is most likely about Giffords' stance on immigration reform, over which there has been a lot of harsh, "vitriolic" (that seems to be the darling word for the press at the moment when talking about this) dialogue. Politicians need to start respecting the responsibility that comes with their influence over people. If they don't, as Angle and Palin did not, things like this happen.

[Fluffy Cocaine]

Oh my god, I was watching Olbermann for a bit and they kept showing a recent picture of the shooting suspect. That is truly the face of a mentally ill man. His facial expression is still haunting me now.

Don't look up the picture if you're easily disturbed by things.

[Nines~Tempest]

Oh my god, I was watching Olbermann for a bit and they kept showing a recent picture of the shooting suspect. That is truly the face of a mentally ill man. His facial expression is still haunting me now.

Don't look up the picture if you're easily disturbed by things.

He's creepy as fuck, but they really should have kept better track of him, the university he was at had called the police several times for his behavior, hell I'm not sure why he was still there, but his illness was well known.